Lezlie Kinyon PhD:

Hi-- OK-- I took a peek-- I'm not sure where you are headed with this, but, it is interesting. (I am consolidating commentary for both of your e-mails).  (BTW: David is pretty busy - he's in tech and has a lot on his plate, don't expect a long reply. Deborah Hammond has requested that she NOT be cc'd in matters concerning this SIG.) I've taken the liberty of cc'ing Bela with this, I have a suspicion that he will be interested.

One at a time:

 I believe that psychodrama is a fantastic tool for exploring dreams, but that dreams are bit more elusive/complex/wonder inducing than defining them as psychodramas in and of themselves (make sense?) -- but, I am getting into the strange wanderings of myth and folklore with that statement.  One can certainly work out one's issues in dreams, but my own explorations go far beyond that. (I like Stan's personal myth approach, it's a powerful tool -- but it's not the entirety of experience, either.) But, then, I no longer think like a therapist.

I have no idea if you are creating a new art form or not -- and, I am not at all qualified to say.  (... what is "art"?) Only the artists of the world will be able to review that one for you -- and, they probably won't.  At least not  yet--

Nit pick: I find the "strike throughs" make the flow of the page hard to get through & distracting -- but, "blogging" is not something I have gotten into at all...perhaps there is a convention here that I am not familiar with. 

Finally-- about systems --  what I am not absorbing -- if you will-- from your web page is this: a system is a "thing" -- a noun, not a verb. (That is not to say that a systems doesn't behave like a verb.) Any system,  be it an atom, a business, a family, a forest, a computer program, a brain, a belief, a ritual ... is a thing.   Systems thinking is a way of thinking about systems.  The systems approach to arts-informed inquiry is utilizing the tools of the arts in inquiring into systems (or, in the case of HAS or engineering hard systems -- designing them) -- make sense?  This is one reason why I find the approaches found in cybernetics to be such a (if I may use the word again) powerful tool to think about systems & systems thinking & design. This is also why, when I talk to Bela, I end up saying things like, "When you write a program, it is so very much the way I do art..."

 This is particularly true when involving the more Platonic -- if you will -- approach to inquiry to be found in art.  I also find it to be (vitally) important to separate out art-as-inquiry (as artists engage in) and arts-informed or arts based inquiry -- as is being used in science research. The approaches that don't take that into account seem to me to become impossible hash fairly quickly.

What I see you doing is engaging in art-as-inquiry in describing the experience of  (insert a phenomenon) -- does that make any sense to  you? (Another example would be Claudio Duran's composition, "Tinta Verde" that he did as a portion of his dissertation at Stanford.)

This does not mean that you aren't engaging in legit science research-- but the surface of things would suggest that your approach is one primarily gleaned from art-making rather than science inquiry. Now, in reading all of this-- remember that I have not seen your most recent work --

I am currently engaged in art-as-inquiry in sacred drama project, it will form my presentation this year, I will share it with you when it is complete.

There you have it -- my 2 cents. Lezlie


"Eric J. Lindblom PhD" <elindblom@hotmail.com> wrote:

Lezlie

Re: Mention of Arts-Informed Inquiry [was: Ackoff Center Weblog]

Thanks for your support (David Ing and for ackoffcenter.blogs.com)! Thanks,
also, for the comment: "Eric is actively involed in actually doing
arts-informed Inquiry and I fully support his inquiries any way that I can."
I have a question for you. I am putting-up a new website:
http://results.bravehost.com . Would you consider my approach Arts-Informed
Inquiry? I suspect I am creating a new art here. Then again, the way I do
it, dreams are psychodramas. Besides, if I do the actual dreamwork at night
while sleeping, I am literally working 24-7 (and sleeping even better as it
turns out).

ciao

Eric



"If I were dropped out of a plane into the ocean and told the nearest land
was a thousand miles away, I'd still swim." Maslow





From: Lezlie
Reply-To: isss06lezlie@yahoo.com
To: David Ing , Bela , "Eric
J. Lindblom PhD"
CC: jp2consult@aol.com, hammond@sonoma.edu, Gary Metcalf
, isssoffice@dsl.pipex.com
Subject: Re: Mention of Arts-Informed Inquiry [was: Ackoff Center Weblog]
Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2006 08:04:40 -0800 (PST)

David-- Eric Lindblom is a friend of many, many years and we correspond
often. I believe that he also worked with Bela while at Saybrook as well.
Our work is complimentary -- unfortunately, he cannot attend ISSS this year
-- which is, in my opinion, very unfortuate. Eric is actively involed in
actually doing arts-informed Inquiry and I fully support his inquiries any
way that I can. In konw he knows that I appreciate his mention of the
exploratory group on his blog. Lezlie

David Ing wrote:
Hi, Lezlie.

Our friend Johnnie has pointed out a response at
http://ackoffcenter.blogs.com/ackoff_center_weblog/2006/02/complexity_demo.html
. The polite thing (in your role as one of the organizers) would be to
leave some commentary on the commentary, to acknowledge how Eric's work does
or doesn't fit with the direction you're headed.

----- Forwarded by David Ing/Markham/IBM on 03/16/2006 12:21 AM -----
jp2consult@aol.com 03/15/2006 11:41 PM
To
David Ing/Markham/IBM@IBMCA cc

Subject
Ackoff Center Weblog






David,
Do you care to comment on the following that has been posted on the
ackoff center weblog?

Comments

The General Systems concept of Arts-Informed Inquiry is brilliant. I
would highly recommend this effort. I have responded in kind. In
respect, response and in support, I have created a course at Harvard
University in Arts-Informed Inquiry:
http://h2o.law.harvard.edu/ViewProject.do?projectID=463 and a
supportive website: http://artsinformed.bravehost.com
Eric J. Lindblom PhD Harvard University, http://elindblom.bravehost.com

Disclaimer: These websites have no affiliation with any other person or
organization.These sites are NOT affiliated with arts-informed or ISSS.

Posted by: Eric J. Lindblom PhD at Mar 15, 2006 7:30:02 PM

For context, Arts-Informed Inquiry, is a Special Interest Group (SIG)
at The 50th Anniversary Conference of the International Society for the
Systems Sciences.
Eric J. Lindblom PhD http://juarez.bravehost.com

Posted by: Eric J. Lindblom PhD at Mar 15, 2006 7:43:48 PM

Thanks and I hope you are well,

Johnnie

John Pourdehnad
Office:(215) 898 3990




Arts-Informed Inquiry SIG,
Lezlie Kinyon & Bela Banathy Organizing Chairs for 2006
http://projects.isss.org/Main/Arts-InformedInquiry
_________________________________________________________________________
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; Wisdom is not putting it in
a fruit salad.
__________________________________________________________________________

http://www.isss.org/conferences/sonoma2006/
Sonoma 2006: The 50th Annual Meeting of the International Society for the
Systems Sciences
Sonoma State University, Rohnert Park, California, USA
July 9th - 14th 2006

Debora Hammond, ISSS President 2005-2006, hammond@sonoma.edu

---------------------------------
Yahoo! Mail
Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.

Arts-Informed Inquiry SIG,
Lezlie Kinyon & Bela Banathy Organizing Chairs for 2006
http://projects.isss.org/Main/Arts-InformedInquiry
_________________________________________________________________________
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; Wisdom is not putting it in
a fruit salad.
__________________________________________________________________________

http://www.isss.org/conferences/sonoma2006/
Sonoma 2006: The 50th Annual Meeting of the International Society for the Systems Sciences
Sonoma State University, Rohnert Park, California, USA
July 9th - 14th 2006

Debora Hammond, ISSS President 2005-2006, hammond@sonoma.edu